close call

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

close call

Sacotu · COBOURG, ONT

well since ya didn't get burned we need pics of the 65 cab.

sasquatch · NORTH BAY, ONT

Maybe he was going to pull you over, was "Running" your plate number, then got a call to a more important scenario?

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

ya like sprinkle donuts were fresh out the deep fryer, dont worry sack dude, pics are coming

Seeker1056 · DOURO, ONT

and maybe your just a little too paranoid

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

If your trailer is that "BAD" then shouldn't you ????????

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

hey believe me i agree 100 percent that trailer of mine is rough, i took a gamble using it that day. it just figures that i almost got nailed

hemi43 · ONTARIO

IMHO I don't think the cops give a rat's ass about trailers. It's the MTO guys that do !!

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

believe me the durham region cops are just as bad or worse than the MTO. on the way home as well yesterday i saw a cobourg police cruiser stopped by an underpass with the lights flashing, i turned the corner and saw a tilt load truck with two street bikes on it, there was two guys sitting at the side of the road, i stopped and asked if they had smacked up their bikes and they said no we got caught speeding, looks like they had thier weekend ruined.

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

here is a couple of pictures of my cab

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Yeah, I'd bust your ass with that trailer !!

Sacotu · COBOURG, ONT

gonna keep the cherry on top? what project is this for?

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

im starting my own fire department

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

That must of been a "fun" trip with the cab at the back of trailer [unless you had heavier stuff up front] & no tongue weight??? Sway much at speed?????

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

actually the cab is at the front, my stuff doesnt sway anyway, i could have had the cab right at the back, my truck tows like a boss

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

fatstax wrote:
actually the cab is at the front, my stuff doesnt sway anyway, i could have had the cab right at the back, my truck tows like a boss

Sorry, couldn't see the tongue end????You are right about the Durham cops, especially in the northern end!!! Think it's BOREDOM, but the MTO & MOE seem to have this area picked as well, & they "TEAM" up & haul your A$$ back to Manchester MTO yard, for safety insp & Emm inspection while your there!!!!

henrys57wagon · WOODLAWN, ONT

In the 60's the Ottawa police used to set up a safety inspection site at Landsdown Park and send vehicles there for inspection, my brother's 58 Impala got caught in one and was taken off the road.

fastchevy · NORTH BAY, ONT

I read and hear about this stuff of you guys getting pulled over left and right,trailers being pulled over etc etc...can't understand why...i live in North Bay and not once have i been pulled over in my cars and i used to travel south and east alot to different shows and events...once i got pulled over with my trailer while bringing my Nova back from Guelph after having the dropped axle put in,,,cop walked around my truck and trailer, came over to me and asked where my yellow stickers were..i asked him what he was talking about and he explained that trailers needed to be certified etc etc.told him i never heard of that,,he told me it started because, when scrap was at the high point, people were overloading trailers and they had a few accidents because of it....then asked me if my car was as light as it looked..i said yea and he said have a nice day...that was 4 years ago. Now, i figure you guys get harrassed because..A.. there are more people down there, hauling overloaded scrap on trailers that should be left at the scrap yard and B..you get pulled over in your rods etc because of the idiot rice burning morons who race around with their annoying stinking pieces of jap scrap endangering people while trying to impress their inbred buddies, making it hard on everybody with a modified vehicle. The solution..slap a ricer whether he is doing anything or not...sooner or later he will do something stupid and piss the cops off, which in turn, will be taken out on you..

hemi43 · ONTARIO

fatstax wrote:

as long as your gvw is less than you are rated for and you are towing your own stuff, not being paid by someone to haul, you dont need any yellow stickers.

I don't want to beat this dead horse again, but where did you ever READ that this is the case. I want you to prove me wrong, but if the combined GVWR of both the truck and trailer is over 4500 kg you need a yellow sticker on both. It doesn't matter if it's commercial or personal or if you're hauling for free.

I wish the law was in fact the way you claim it is, because I would love to buy an enclosed trailer for my personal use, but I refuse to get both my truck and any trailer I own certified every year.

Please give me some proof, a link, anything !! Not a friend of a friend told me.

-- Edited by hemi43 on Thursday 23rd of August 2012 05:31:38 PM

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

dualquadpete wrote:
fatstax wrote:
actually the cab is at the front, my stuff doesnt sway anyway, i could have had the cab right at the back, my truck tows like a boss
Sorry, couldn't see the tongue end????You are right about the Durham cops, especially in the northern end!!! Think it's BOREDOM, but the MTO & MOE seem to have this area picked as well, & they "TEAM" up & haul your A$$ back to Manchester MTO yard, for safety insp & Emm inspection while your there!!!!

your not kidding, they setup in my town and have their little blitzes, they have a nice little area setup with a a couple of flat decks ready to tow your car or truck away. they must think they are heros or something. as long as your gvw is less than you are rated for and you are towing your own stuff, not being paid by someone to haul, you dont need any yellow stickers. my little encounter is the motivation i needed to rebuild the frame of my trailer and get it more legit.

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

Dan, I 've got a letter from the Minister of Transportation that was forwarded to me thru MPP John Otoole in re-guards to yellow sticker. I my case the letter states that" if you haul your car trailer with a Suburban that has "car" plates the Tow vehicle does not need to have sticker,but if your over the 4500 Kg. the trailer does!!!I keep this letter in G/box of the "Burb" but still haven't got trailer stickered [yellow] in all the time I've owned it [15yrs] I wouldn't bring the letter out "till I absolutley have too"

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Thanks Pete !! I guess it's a lot like the MOE crap, and that it's open to interpretation. It would be great to have a place to go to, to get these questions answered properly. I stopped in at the MTO on the 401 (Bowmanville) and they never mentioned anything about "car" plates. Oh well !!

OldGuy 71Acadian · ONTARIO

hemi43 wrote:
as long as your gvw is less than you are rated for and you are towing your own stuff, not being paid by someone to haul, you dont need any yellow stickers.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^100% Wrong!
if the combined GVWR of both the truck and trailer is over 4500 kg you need a yellow sticker on both. It doesn't matter if it's commercial or personal or if you're hauling for free.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^100% Correct!
Pete, there is nothing in the HTA that distinguishes between car or truck plates. Combined GVWR over 4500kg of tow vehicle and unit being towed. They have steadily lowered this weight over the years, to the point where now people hauling their big fancy boats around are getting nailed. You house trailer people are exempt.

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

OldGuy 71Acadian wrote:
hemi43 wrote:
as long as your gvw is less than you are rated for and you are towing your own stuff, not being paid by someone to haul, you dont need any yellow stickers.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^100% Wrong!
if the combined GVWR of both the truck and trailer is over 4500 kg you need a yellow sticker on both. It doesn't matter if it's commercial or personal or if you're hauling for free.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^100% Correct!
Pete, there is nothing in the HTA that distinguishes between car or truck plates. Combined GVWR over 4500kg of tow vehicle and unit being towed. They have steadily lowered this weight over the years, to the point where now people hauling their big fancy boats around are getting nailed. You house trailer people are exempt.
That may be the case but I've got a "signed" letter from the MINISTER if it's wrong then thats his or her fault & stupitity, but I think it might get me off for "misleading me, down the garden path"

OldGuy 71Acadian · ONTARIO

dualquadpete wrote:
That may be the case but I've got a "signed" letter from the MINISTER if it's wrong then thats his or her fault & stupitity, but I think it might get me off for "misleading me, down the garden path"
Another valid point to what we are all saying. They don't even know their own rules.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Here is the law ;
No where does it state that non-commercial vehicles are exempt. At the bottom of the link they mention a CVOR. A CVOR in NOT related to the yellow sticker so please don't confuse the two.

http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/pubs/recreational-vehicles/part8.shtml

-- Edited by hemi43 on Monday 27th of August 2012 02:56:35 PM

DaveM · ONTARIO

dualquadpete wrote:
Dan, I 've got a letter from the Minister of Transportation that was forwarded to me thru MPP John Otoole in re-guards to yellow sticker. I my case the letter states that" if you haul your car trailer with a Suburban that has "car" plates the Tow vehicle does not need to have sticker,but if your over the 4500 Kg. the trailer does!!!I keep this letter in G/box of the "Burb" but still haven't got trailer stickered [yellow] in all the time I've owned it [15yrs] I wouldn't bring the letter out "till I absolutley have too"

Check your ownership for your Suburban with "car" plates. The registered GVW is on it. MTO/OPP/Regional coppers won't care about a letter. You'll have to save that for the judge.

My 2001 Dodge Dakota has a Register GVW on the ownership of 3000kg. My basic 6'x10' enclosed utility trailer is rated 1356kg. That's 4356kg for a small truck with a small utility trailer. Not far away from what would require a yellow sticker.

Legally....you canot haul a yellow stickered trailer behind a non yellow stickered truck.

Legally....if your truck is yellow stickered, ANY cargo trailer behind it must be stickered as well. Even if it is a single snowmobile trailer.

Them's the rules.

If it is a homebuilt trailer with no factory ratings, you might have a chance. They'll go by actual weight.

-- Edited by DaveM on Monday 27th of August 2012 03:06:04 PM

-- Edited by DaveM on Monday 27th of August 2012 03:06:32 PM

DaveM · ONTARIO

Check the GVW on the ownership while your out there. See if it's different if it registered with "car" plates. Inquiring minds need to know.

-- Edited by DaveM on Monday 27th of August 2012 07:23:40 PM

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

since some of you are so aggressivley responding to what i said, i just emailed the minister of the MTO and they will respond to my question with the correct answer. i will post the answer when i get it. i want to know as well.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Great !! Looking forward to the answer. The information I gave above is exactly what was told to me by 3 MTO officers when I stopped in at the weigh scales on the 401 in Bowmanville. They also printed off and gave me a copy of the regulation to back up what they were saying.

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

if this is the case my friends kid is lying to him then. i would like to know from the source. as well if you can get these people to put stuff in writing its as good as gold

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

from what i can read in that link, it kind of confirms what i was told, as long as its for personal use, you dont need a yellow sticker, up to 6000kg it would seem. still seems murky to me. as soon as i get an email from the MTO i will post it.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

fatstax wrote:
from what i can read in that link, it kind of confirms what i was told, as long as its for personal use, you dont need a yellow sticker, up to 6000kg it would seem. still seems murky to me. as soon as i get an email from the MTO i will post it.

Hard to type when I'm banging my freaking head against the table !! confuse

I especially mentioned NOT TO INCLUDED THE CVOR SECTION ON THE BOTTOM !!

hemi43 · ONTARIO

From the MTO web site;

Frequently Asked Questions

2. What vehicles need to be inspected under the National Standard?

Annual Inspection and Safety Standars Certificate (SSC):

Trucks, trailers and converter dollies alone or in combination with a total gross weight, registered gross weight or manufacturer’s gross vehicle weight rating exceeding 4,500 kilograms (kg),

"Truck" includes, but is not limited to truck tractors, straight trucks, pickup trucks, curb side/cube vans, trade vans/panel trucks, and passenger vans and two and four wheel drive sport utility vehicles while being used to transport cargo, other than personal effects, with one or more of the vehicle's rear seats removed. This applies regardless of how the vehicle is plated, e.g., car, truck or farm plated.

"Trailer" means a vehicle that is at any time drawn upon a highway by a motor vehicle, except an implement of husbandry, a mobile home, another motor vehicle or any device or apparatus not designed to transport persons or property, temporarily drawn, propelled or moved upon such highway, and except a side car attached to a motorcycle, and shall be considered a separate vehicle and not part of the motor vehicle by which it is drawn.

"Trailer converter dolly" means a device consisting of one or more axles, a fifth wheel lower-half and a tow bar.

Trailers include, but is not limited to boat, snowmobile, livestock, and general purpose utility trailers. "Trailer" does not include devices such as tar pots, portable welders, cement mixers, compressors, farm implements such as farm wagons, etc.

Annual Inspection, Semi-Annual Inspection and Safety Standars Certificate (SSC):

"Bus", any motor vehicle designed for the transportation of 10 or more passengers excluding the driver; e.g. passenger van, limousine, motor coach, school bus, etc. Buses with a manufacturer’s gross vehicle weight rating of 4,500 kg or less used exclusively for personal use are exempt from the annual and semi-annual inspections.

"Accessible Vehicle", any vehicle that has been modified for the purpose of transporting persons with disabilities whether or not the vehicle is also used for transporting persons without disabilities, excluding those used exclusively for personal use; e.g. this could include a, mini-van, passenger van or taxi that has been modified for accessibility.

"School Purposes Vehicles" any vehicle operating under contract with a school board or other authority in charge of a school being used for the transportation of six or more children or adults with a developmental disability; e.g. this could include any vehicle including school buses.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

I think the "loop hole" on SUV or passenger Van with pass. plates is" while hauling cargo with one or more of the seats removed"!!! Least thats how I read it??? As per usual, so many gray areas that they leave "open" to your reading!!!! Going to go out soon & re read the leatter from Minister of MOT or DOT or whatever!!!!

hemi43 · ONTARIO

DaveM wrote:
Check the GVW on the ownership while your out there. See if it's different if it registered with "car" plates. Inquiring minds need to know.

-- Edited by DaveM on Monday 27th of August 2012 07:23:40 PM

The MTO will use the GVWR from the manufacturer which is usually located on the driver's door (sticker) The GVWR stated on the ownership is a direct reflection of the type of plates you have on the vehicle. Most pickups will have 3000kg listed there because that's the limit of personal plates.

To increase this number to the Manufacturer's GVWR, then you must purchase the appropriate sticker which I think is around $140 per year. I have never officially looked into the higher priced sticker so maybe someone that actually has might be able to confirm this.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

dualquadpete wrote:
I think the "loop hole" on SUV or passenger Van with pass. plates is" while hauling cargo with one or more of the seats removed"!!! Least thats how I read it??? As per usual, so many gray areas that they leave "open" to your reading!!!! Going to go out soon & re read the leatter from Minister of MOT or DOT or whatever!!!!

I agree it is hard to read, but the the part you mentioned above about 1 or 2 seats removed is the Ministrie's way of determining the difference between a bus or a truck. What they're saying is, let say you buy a School bus and leave all the seats in it, it will remain a bus. If you remove 1 or more seats then this bus now becomes a truck. I think this was put in there to prevent people from buying buses and converting them to car haulers like they used to do for hauling race cars. As far as the yellow sticker, it doesn't really matter if you own a bus or a truck because if you're over the 4500 KG then you will need the yellow sticker (SSC)

What guys are doing now is using C-class motor homes for hauling their race cars, because the motor home is exempt from the yellow sticker (SSC) because it is clasified as an RV.

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

the gvw on my truck is 4500 kg, its 136 dollars a year

hemi43 · ONTARIO

fatstax wrote:
the gvw on my truck is 4500 kg, its 136 dollars a year

I've been researching this stuff now for over an hour, and learning stuff I had no clue about.

Fatstax, from what I'm reading, the price you pay for your sticker must match the weight of both the truck and trailer combined.

Even if you had a yellow sticker on both your truck and trailer, your weight limit is 4500kg combined.

If this information that I'm reading is correct, then 99.9% of people out there towing a trailer could get fined for not having the proper plate sticker.

I have a 1/2 ton 2wd pickup that I tow a trailer with 2 ATVs in it. My actual weight is 8800 lbs (4000 kg) This is below 4500kg, so I don't need a yellow sticker. I'm now wondering if my plate sticker is legal. I have black personal plates that cost $74 per year and my ownership has 3000kg listed as the GVWR.

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

u would be overweight then, if you are 4000kg and your ownership says 3000kg, technically you are over but since its recreational, i dont think it matters. i hope today i get a response from the MTO as i plan on barraging them with many more questions. my other option if i am incorrect about my gvw with a trailer is to register my truck over the 4500 kg, once i do this i need a yearly inspection and an e test no matter how old my truck is. i wont need a cvor but i will possibly need to do a daily inspection report. once again another grey area. digging into the MTO web of rules and contradictions is difficult.

JPB · AYLMER, ONT

The M T O has an inspection BLITZ in our town everyspring /fall when there are more trucks on the area roads.Like a fellow posted,these 'scrappers' that haul once or twice a year when prices zoom are careless. NOT all of them though. A good friend of mine does it for a living and takes ALL the necessary precations:trapped load,straps,nothing hanging over the top etc. Some people just don't care. cry

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

ive hauled for over 15 years and i have never lost a car or a load yet. i always over do it when it comes to securing a load or a car, its not worth the fines and trouble if something falls off.

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

I wish I could find the picture of the Farm Combine I took to the scrap yard on the car trailer, after many cuts to get rid of the "extra" weight & enough straps & chains to sink a ship the Suburban didn't even flinch. rolled across the scale at almost 13000 lbs. a 'little over" I just about "SH&T" a brick when i saw that #!! "Burb has a GVW on door of 7400Lbs. & thats about right when i do a 'dump run" Theres no GVW on the ownership,but owners manual says I can tow Max GCWR [Gross Combination Weight Rating] of 11,500 lbs.[3;42gears] or11,000lbs with 3:08 gears [5216&4990 Kg's] if your into metric, I'm not] but thats over the 9,900 lbs [4500kg]Ont weights. Ok what would happen if you where using a station wagon, no GVW on vehicle, so "no weight restriction"??? Just thinking [OUCH!!]

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Grumpsbodyworks wrote:
Don't forget.....

You must complete a daily inspection log of your vehicle if its stickered and a daily log book if you travel over 160 km

just sayin.......

WRONG!!!

Come on guys !! Do some research before you post stuff without knowing if it's true or not !!

Now you're talking about a CVOR which has nothing to do with the yellow sticker !!

Geeeezzzzz !!

Hey Grump; I just saw a picture of your truck and trailer with the two rods on it. How do you have this licencensed ?? Obviously the truck and trailer are yellow stickered, but do you have this truck registered to a business?? What type of plates are on the truck and how much does the sticker cost you ?? Also, what type of hitch are you pulling that trailer with? Just an estimate of the trailer and cars on it, I would estimate the weight to be in the 8500 lbs area. I'm not rying to be a smart ass, but would really like to know how you're legally towing this down the road. This might answer a lot of our questions.

I would guess that the reason you said you needed a log book is because you infact have a CVOR. You would have to with that much weight rolling down the road.

-- Edited by hemi43 on Wednesday 29th of August 2012 03:56:55 PM

hemi43 · ONTARIO

dualquadpete wrote:
I wish I could find the picture of the Farm Combine I took to the scrap yard on the car trailer, after many cuts to get rid of the "extra" weight & enough straps & chains to sink a ship the Suburban didn't even flinch. rolled across the scale at almost 13000 lbs. a 'little over" I just about "SH&T" a brick when i saw that #!! "Burb has a GVW on door of 7400Lbs. & thats about right when i do a 'dump run" Theres no GVW on the ownership,but owners manual says I can tow Max GCWR [Gross Combination Weight Rating] of 11,500 lbs.[3;42gears] or11,000lbs with 3:08 gears [5216&4990 Kg's] if your into metric, I'm not] but thats over the 9,900 lbs [4500kg]Ont weights. Ok what would happen if you where using a station wagon, no GVW on vehicle, so "no weight restriction"??? Just thinking [OUCH!!]

Your Suburban has no GVW on the ownership because you have passenger car plates ( Blue ). Pickup trucks must have truck plates (Black) and that's why the max GVW of the sticker is listed on the ownership.

A station wagon will have a weight restriction. That information is listed inside the drivers door like most vehicles.

Cat in the Hat · BRANTFORD, ONT

Don't forget.....

You must complete a daily inspection log of your vehicle if its stickered and a daily log book if you travel over 160 km

just sayin.......

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Thanks for that info !! Much appreciated !!
Just so I have this right, any personal pick-up truck with a yellow sticker, you say needs a daily log book for inspection and a daily log book for travel??
The reason I said "wrong" to your statement is because these rules only apply if you have a CVOR.
If I tow my personal boat, with my personal half ton pick-up but fall into the 4500 and above catagory, then I agree that I need to have a yellow sticker on both the truck and trailer. This does not mean I need a CVOR. If I don't need a CVOR, then I do not need to keep log books.

Here is the the legal definition I copied and pasted from MTO;
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pickups that weigh or are registered for over 4,500 kgs and are only ever used for personal purposes or are only ever used to tow personal use trailers, including house and camper trailers are exempt from the requirements to have a commercial vehicle operator registration certificate, from conducting daily vehicle inspections and from drivers being subject to the hours-of-service requirements.

In order for a pickup to qualify for the above exemption it must have a vehicle weight rating of 6,000 kgs (13,227 lbs) or less and be fitted with either, the original unmodified pickup box that was installed by the manufacturer or an unmodified replacement box that duplicates the one that was installed by the manufacturer.

-- Edited by hemi43 on Wednesday 29th of August 2012 07:54:40 PM

Modfather · VICTORIA HARBOUR, ONT

Well at least this is not another emissions thread. Boy you fellas all like playing with the different laws and bylaws and what ever. Is it all just to create conversations gossip and rumors?

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Modfather wrote:
Well at least this is not another emissions thread. Boy you fellas all like playing with the different laws and bylaws and what ever. Is it all just to create conversations gossip and rumors?

Quite the opposite !! we all need to be educated and informed on what the laws are. I think talking about this is a good thing, be we must have the proper information. This is not the 1970s anymore, and we are governed by so many rules today that it affects us all. The onus is on you to find out what the laws are because the ignorance of them will not get you out of a ticket.

Cat in the Hat · BRANTFORD, ONT

RIGHT !

MTO rules and explenations included

Vehicles That Require Inspection

A Daily Vehicle Inspection Is Required To Be Conducted On:

•a single truck that has a registered gross weight or an actual weight over 4,500 kg (9,920 lbs).
•a truck and trailer combination if a truck has a registered gross weight over 4,500 kg or a truck's actual weight, with the trailer attached is over 4,500 kg.

personal use pickup truck
means a pickup truck;
•that has a manufacturer’s gross vehicle weight rating of 6,000 kg (13,227 lb) or less, and
•is fitted with either,
◦the original box that was installed by the manufacturer, which has not been modified, or
◦a replacement box that duplicates the one that was installed by the manufacturer, which has not been modified.
and
•is being used for personal purposes without compensation, and
•is not carrying, or towing a trailer that is carrying commercial cargo or tools or equipment of a type normally used for commercial purposes.

Your right...I did carry both hot rods on a comercial trailer pulled by a comercial truck

1) Truck is Licensed as comercial 5500 kg.....$145...yearly inspected
2) Trailer is licensed for 4500 kg.......$25 light for tri-axle
3) 10,000 lbs class 5 hitch
4) Trailer with 2 cars weighed 3000 kg
5) I did fill out a log book.....but.....I put "Private Carrier Not for Hire" stickers on the truck

Private carrier stickers allow a comercial truck to run as a personal truck without noted modified box.

no problems........but I still filled a log....just in case...

But during the week....the truck runs a daily inspection book ( does not go further than 100 km a day)

Clear as mud?????