72 MOPAR info

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

72 MOPAR info

Gazoo · BADEN, ONT

Hey Pete, just sent you a PM, but figured I might as well post here as well, as this info could be useful to others also. Gearhead is right Mopars suck when it comes to swaps. The "K" member swap is the better way to go, but....(there's always one), it's also a lot of extra work, if all the brakes, steering and suspension are good. The easiest/fastest/cheapest way to go is with mounts from these guys, http://www.engine-swaps.com/ . The only other thing I'd upgrade, would be torsion bars, and disc brakes (if he doesn't have them).

-- Edited by Gazoo on Monday 14th of January 2013 04:54:47 PM

-- Edited by Gazoo on Monday 14th of January 2013 04:55:35 PM

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Same k-member !! The rubber mounts are the same too for small block and big block.
The slant 6 had a unique K-member, as did the Hemi ( which was not available in 72)

That big block will bolt right up, but larger diameter torsion bars would be a good idea.Also the driveshaft will have to be shortened because the 727 is a bit longer.

That's why I love Mopars!! Everything does interchange.

I found this that confirms the info I gave above. http://www.houstonmopars.org/engswp.html

-- Edited by hemi43 on Monday 14th of January 2013 06:51:47 PM

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

Friend of mine's son has bought a 72 Charger that had a 360 V8 installed with a 904 auto. He has sold that d/line & has a 383 727 combo to install. People have been telling him he either they have to change the "K" member, for B block or get after mrkt. Mount kit, to install the 383 where the 360 [A block] was??? Any body know for sure what has to be done here!!! Thanks Pete

hemi43 · ONTARIO

If you need any other info such as disc swaps, let me know. I have been down this road many times.

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

hemi43 wrote:
Same k-member !! The rubber mounts are the same too for small block and big block.
The slant 6 had a unique K-member, as did the Hemi ( which was not available in 72)

Hats off, I stand corrected. What Hemi says makes sense - I had to swap the K out on my dart to take a 360 (was the 225 slant) and knew the hemi K was different. Then again its been 30 years since I touched a real Mopar (Grand Caravan doesnt count)

I think its about time I got another A body...its still in my bones

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

73's changed the c pillar to make larger rear quarter windows. Front wheel openings are different, different bumpers and some other mechanical changes. Value also depletes the further away they get from the '69 model. I'm the oddball, I like seem to like most '71 models the best. I personally think 1971 was Mopars hottest year with the Charger, Cuda, Challenger, RR/GTX, Superbee (basically a Charger and the rarest Bee) and Duster all looking totally badass. By the end of 74 it was all over. I wouldn't thank you for any mopar from '75 on.

-- Edited by Gearhead on Tuesday 15th of January 2013 04:40:39 PM

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

Pint and a Pound wrote:
hemi43 wrote:

The problem is that the 383 was never available as an emission engine, therefore there's no EGR manifolds for it because the 440 manifold won't fit (too wide)
73 was a crappy year for emission controls because it was (for Mopar) the year that major components came into effect. I realize that there's different ways to add this stuff on an old engine, but it may just be easier for him to find a smog 440. Just my opinion!! I don't want to see a kid dump all his cash into a car, only to find out it's gonna cost him a whole lot more to make it legal.

Wouldn't an intake from a 400 smogger fit? I thought the 400 was a B engine rather than an RB like the 440.

Correct, it is a B block. The 440 suggestion might be even better though - lots of those around. Most of the 400's have dissapeared thankfully

-- Edited by Gearhead on Tuesday 15th of January 2013 09:06:21 PM

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

Just passed this on to Dale & he informs me the car is a 73?? Any difference!!!!!! in the info gained here. thanks & sorry I'm not a Mopar guy & thought it was a 72 by looking at it.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Not to beat an old dead horse, but please explain to your friend's Son why he can't put that 383 in that 1973 Emission loaded car so it will save him the headaches down the road.

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

hemi43 wrote:
Not to beat an old dead horse, but please explain to your friend's Son why he can't put that 383 in that 1973 Emission loaded car so it will save him the headaches down the road.

Unless he puts all that junk on the 383. We assume its a street car but its possible its a bracket car...a big one!

Gazoo · BADEN, ONT

I could be wrong, but I believe '73 went to a spool mount style K member, and I believe no K swap there either.
I'm used to working on A bodies, and nothing is a straight swap.

427CARL · CLINTON, ONT

http://www.engine-swaps.com/Pages/InstructionPages/73andUpV8-BRB.html have to change oil pan

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Gearhead wrote:
hemi43 wrote:
Not to beat an old dead horse, but please explain to your friend's Son why he can't put that 383 in that 1973 Emission loaded car so it will save him the headaches down the road.

Unless he puts all that junk on the 383. We assume its a street car but its possible its a bracket car...a big one!

The problem is that the 383 was never available as an emission engine, therefore there's no EGR manifolds for it because the 440 manifold won't fit (too wide)

73 was a crappy year for emission controls because it was (for Mopar) the year that major components came into effect. I realize that there's different ways to add this stuff on an old engine, but it may just be easier for him to find a smog 440. Just my opinion!! I don't want to see a kid dump all his cash into a car, only to find out it's gonna cost him a whole lot more to make it legal. smile

hemi43 · ONTARIO

I just Googled it, and a 400 with a 440 crank will net 451 CI.

Here's some good info;

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_difference_between_a_383_magnum_and_400_engine

-- Edited by hemi43 on Wednesday 16th of January 2013 12:22:38 PM

hemi43 · ONTARIO

I can't recall if the 400 is a "B"or an "RB", but I think you might be correct Pint !! What I do know is that the 400 had the largest bore of all the big blocks, and guys used to run 440 cranks in them and getting close to 500 cubes. The 400s had good cylinder heads (452 casting) and that's what I used in my Road Runner with a 440.
383s were a good engine, but I love 440s !! They are just a torque monster!! Ah, brings back memories......

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

I'll take that pint even though I'm 1% unsure if I'm right. I'm almost certain it is a bored out 383 b block. Very cool to know a 440 crank could be used to bring it up to 500...I thought there wasn't much that could be done with those old stones

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

This is a can of worms!! They sold the late model 360 without taking anything off it!!! Bought a complete 383 & 727 trans. thinking that 73 didn't have any emm. Some of the info linked here says 73 came with a big block & will bolt in, then they show pictures of having to drill new holes in mounts but don't say if thats for A or b or any of the other ones listed !! Just 'lump all the bodies together??? very confussing if you don't know MOPARS!! he shouldn't have bought this car!! nor should they have bought this 383 without doing some research!! His Dad is now caught in the middle trying to straighten all this out. Shiney paint & shiney wheels DO NOT make a great car, butchered carb. linkage, mickey mouse wiring, & every bolt holding the engine in was "LOOSE & different sizes"

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

Oh Brother - that's a pickle alright. Going back to Hemi's suggestion of finding a smogger 440 and letting the 383 go might be your best option. There's lots of big ol' mopars out there with 440's in them. Up to 76-78 I think. Buy the complete mess or better yet, the whole car and part out the rest?

Since you have to run all the emissions, would they consider ditching the 383 for a late model Hemi? Look for a wreck and grab the motor, trans, harness, computer etc. The upside is you have lots of power, fuel economy, overdrive and are doing something green to boot. So you have to run dual cats....no biggie. It will be the meanest, greenest Charger out there. Paint it "Mean green"
just a thought

hemi43 · ONTARIO

dualquadpete wrote:
This is a can of worms!! They sold the late model 360 without taking anything off it!!! Bought a complete 383 & 727 trans. thinking that 73 didn't have any emm. Some of the info linked here says 73 came with a big block & will bolt in, then they show pictures of having to drill new holes in mounts but don't say if thats for A or b or any of the other ones listed !! Just 'lump all the bodies together??? very confussing if you don't know MOPARS!! he shouldn't have bought this car!! nor should they have bought this 383 without doing some research!! His Dad is now caught in the middle trying to straighten all this out. Shiney paint & shiney wheels DO NOT make a great car, butchered carb. linkage, mickey mouse wiring, & every bolt holding the engine in was "LOOSE & different sizes"

Where is this guy located?? I'll help him any way I can !! I know Mopars because that's all I've ever had since I was 16. 1973 is a little newer than what i'm used to, but other than the emission crap it's the same as the late 60's cars.

spring77 · BARRIE, ONT

Back in the day, I swapped a 383 Super Bee motor, with 727 trans into a 71 Satellite..B -body, same as the Charger..no probs...K frame is oK as is

Biggest prob was switching the 318 ps pump.for the big block

2 guys that are handy with wrenches can pull this off in a weekend..easy..

get a bigger rad tho, and running a trans cooler is always a good idea..

Good luck

Gearhead · ELORA, ONT

The engine swap isn't the issue here - being emissions compliant is

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Here's an excellent site with pictures of different years of K-frames

http://www.engine-swaps.com/Pages/ProductsType/K-Frames.html

It looks like 1973 is the year they changed the motor mounts to the newer style called "spool mounts". It seems like all the big blocks used the same mount regardless of body style, so that 383 should bolt right up if he uses 73-up big block motor mounts.
I would then search out a 400 manifold and bolt it on the 383. If he has an EGR hooked up , as well as other emission stuff from 73 ( there wasn't too much ) I don't think he will have a problem. If he get pulled over by the MOE, they will just want to verify that the stuff is there, and I don't think they are going to try and find out what year the block is. Just my opinion !!

spring77 · BARRIE, ONT

True about emissions...rules we have to play by, but its strange..that MOST! rodded cars and trucks probably have less emissions, because we take care of our cars better, than the average joe.. But the MTO knows best apparently..

RacerRick · TORONTO, ONT

Because the 400 and 440 could come in the car from the factory, just put whatever was factory equipped emissions wise on the 383. There is next to nothing on a 72' for emissions anyways.

The 360 was not original to that car anyways. You couldn't get one in a 72' B body.

The K-member does not need to change, and just get 72' big block mounts and isolators. It is all a bolt in with no drilling or cutting. You will need a different rad unless you use the late model water pump, and you should get one anyways just to cool the bigger motor properly. Also, check the rear end. If it was an original 318 car, it might have the 8.25" rear which is a big weak for a healthy big block in a heavy car like that charger.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

RacerRick wrote:
Because the 400 and 440 could come in the car from the factory, just put whatever was factory equipped emissions wise on the 383. There is next to nothing on a 72' for emissions anyways.

The 360 was not original to that car anyways. You couldn't get one in a 72' B body.

The K-member does not need to change, and just get 72' big block mounts and isolators. It is all a bolt in with no drilling or cutting. You will need a different rad unless you use the late model water pump, and you should get one anyways just to cool the bigger motor properly. Also, check the rear end. If it was an original 318 car, it might have the 8.25" rear which is a big weak for a healthy big block in a heavy car like that charger.

The car is a 73, not a 72 !! If I recall, all big blocks had the water inlet in the same location, only the small block changed sides.

RacerRick · TORONTO, ONT

hemi43 wrote:
RacerRick wrote:
Because the 400 and 440 could come in the car from the factory, just put whatever was factory equipped emissions wise on the 383. There is next to nothing on a 72' for emissions anyways.

The 360 was not original to that car anyways. You couldn't get one in a 72' B body.

The K-member does not need to change, and just get 72' big block mounts and isolators. It is all a bolt in with no drilling or cutting. You will need a different rad unless you use the late model water pump, and you should get one anyways just to cool the bigger motor properly. Also, check the rear end. If it was an original 318 car, it might have the 8.25" rear which is a big weak for a healthy big block in a heavy car like that charger.
The car is a 73, not a 72 !! If I recall, all big blocks had the water inlet in the same location, only the small block changed sides.

Woops - should be pretty much the same, but has a rubber mounted K member, instead of solid. First year of spool mounts, so just needs a set of them. I can't remember the year they changed the water pump outlet from the drivers side to the passenger side, which would allow you to use the small block rad. I am currently going through all of this with the 383 going into my 57' plymouth.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

I wish they had "spool mounts" in the 60's cars !! I probably tore a half-dozen driver's side mounts with my 440 until I snugged it down with a chain.
I remember once at a major intersection in Scarborough (Kingston rd & Morningside), I was making a left hand turn and stood on it and it broke the driver's rubber mount. The engine came up so hard that the grease nipple from the inboard tie rod punched a hole in my headder tube and jammed in. (Mopars have 1 tube going under the steering) I nearly hit the light standard because I had no more steering, and was stuck in the intersection. After I wiggled the steering wheel a bit, I heard the engine drop back into place, so off I went !! I put that chain on that night !! Ahhh, the memories !!

spring77 · BARRIE, ONT

RE: 72 MOPAR info	Reply Quote Printer Friendly

I wish they had "spool mounts" in the 60's cars !! I probably tore a half-dozen driver's side mounts with my 440 until I snugged it down with a chain. I remember once at a major intersection in Scarborough (Kingston rd & Morningside), I was making a left hand turn and stood on it and it broke the driver's rubber mount. The engine came up so hard that the grease nipple from the inboard tie rod punched a hole in my headder tube and jammed in. (Mopars have 1 tube going under the steering) I nearly hit the light standard because I had no more steering, and was stuck in the intersection. After I wiggled the steering wheel a bit, I heard the engine drop back into place, so off I went !! I put that chain on that night !! Ahhh, the memories !! "Chaining"..the drivers side down, used to be almost mandatory ,in the old days , with Big block Chryslers...it got pretty monotonous replacing motor mounts, after a weekend of..ahhh...hijinks...

RacerRick · TORONTO, ONT

I used to tear up the stock "biscuit" mounts all the time with my 340. I had it chained down also.