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Post Info TOPIC: It just occurred to me


PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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It just occurred to me
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It just occurred to me this morning that I could build my own frame now and start from scratch.  I could rebuild my ride and do it all the way I now know is best.  Cool.  So has anyone here built their own frame with tubing?  A few basic questions: Do I have to have a jig to ensure the finished item is square and true ?  If I weld it up myself, what would be the cost of a frame for a model A approximately ?  Sure I know, a lot of work but it sounds like fun.  I could do the frame better.IMG_6802.JPG



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COBBLE HILL, BC

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There are lots of home made 2x3" frames out there.
Some good, some not so good.


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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Thank you Jarvis1. Good to know but I think I want to build one more than I want to get one. I just have to learn how much is involved in making one correctly. I don't want to learn how to make one "not so good". I could probably do that now ! hahaha But thank you. That is very good to know.

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GRIMSBY, ONT

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i used hortons prefabbed bendsDSC05121.JPGDSC05170.JPG



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WATFORD, ONT

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Wescotts Auto has a good dimensional frame drawing for the 28-31 Model A. (They have a few other years as well for those that may be interested.) Also a bit of info on frame alignment, plus other tutorials in their tech section. I thought it might pay off to take a look and you can determine the various steel sizes and layout. Go to www.wescottsauto.com and look in the tech section.

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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I don't know if it is the photos or just early morning sleepiness but now the thought of making a frame frightens me. The images are gorgeous but would I be diving in too deep too soon? Just too anxious to learn maybe? That looks so nice, it's a shame to cover it all with a body. Wescotts Auto, eh? I will check. I was just going to take my existing dimensions and modify where I wanted. It sure will be nice when this covid is over and I can actually see people building stuff. Thank you Scotty. That is beautiful !

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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I guess because I see an image like the one below, I get the impression that maybe I could try that:vlcsnap-2020-12-20-14h43m09s278.png vlcsnap-2020-12-20-14h44m20s915.png It looks like they added this extension to the frame they already had made.  It looks like maybe I could do the same and enjoy doing it.  But then I see the images Scotty sub,its and I wonder how I could ever imagine me doing this.  It now appears a formidable task far beyond me.  Maybe in time I'll gain the confidence but I better concentrate on getting some practice first and see how it goes.  Thank you Scotty.  I guess I had my mind in the clouds.  Still, fun to dream.  Maybe some day?



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Eastwood Company has a really good how to video U-tube which walks you though building a Model A framehttps://www.youtube.com/watch

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Yeah I saw that video. They make a lot of great videos but now I wonder if they don't give me just a bit too much confidence after seeing the great work that Scotty did. I have to learn to slow down (when I'm not in my ride). I want to learn too much too fast.

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BLACKSTOCK, ONT

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You really need a steel "frame table" that's "LEVEL" all around and tons of jig clamps and fasteners!! As soon as you start welding it's going to WARP somewhere without the proper support!!! Not really a project for a beginner and going to have to spend a lot of $$ just to start!!!

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GRIMSBY, ONT

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my collection of clamps is some where around 40 now  and you need to sit down with your welding machine and have a chat with it to see if it still can perform 



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www.autoweldchassis.com/

These guys have some neat stuff

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GRIMSBY, ONT

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yes they have nice stuff but you can buy a good welder and clamps and metal and still have enough left over to put an addition on your garage  



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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Now THAT's exactly what I needed to know. Thank you dualquadpete. I suspected about the table for a level base and I already saw a lot of Eastwood videos (great stuff I use a lot to learn from). And thank you everyone for your input. Beginners need to hear from you. Thank you. Maybe someday ... but not now.

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COBBLE HILL, BC

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Have you looked at Hortons products?

 

https://welderseries.ecwid.com/



-- Edited by jarvis1 on Wednesday 30th of December 2020 12:15:34 AM

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Yes Jarvis1, I have a Hortons catalogue that I use like an old Sears Christmas Wish catalogue. But the thrill of altering my frame like in the images I posted is doing it myself. I thought that because the two frame extensions that hold the motor were just a few feet long, I could fabricate them on my bench. Of course I know I need to practice welding a lot but a project this size appeared (past tense) within my reach. I guess it isn't but it was fun to dream. Thank you Jarvis1.

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MARKHAM, ONT

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A frame table is not required.
Just make sure everything is square and parallel with each other. I keep a piece of glass in the garage for this purpose.
I also keep a smaller piece with emery cloth glued on it for sanding things flat.

 

IMG_1028 (Medium).jpg

 

 

 

IMG_2131 (Medium).jpg



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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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That's brilliant Pugsy ! Thank you. So do you think making these two parts would be beyond me ? I could have someone else attach them to the frame but making them - that would be a blast !

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MARKHAM, ONT

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Yes, but only if you post pictures of every step, including the scrap welding test pieces, before and after welding.
We need to see how the parts are prepared before welding begins.

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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OK. It's a fair ways off but when the day comes, I will post as I progress. Even if it is beyond me, it will be good practice. Thank you for all of your support. I know from doing the shell that if it isn't good enough, I have to do more until it's right. You taught me that and not to rush. I still have to figure out how to raise the rear a bit first. I bottom out in potholes and speed bumps can be a real challenge.

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AJAX, ONT

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There are a few ways to keep things square and level without a frame table. I can clamp stuff down to the table and weld it and still have it move.

If you are not an experienced welder I would practice welding. Proper welder setup, distance and speed. All tubing joints should be sleeved for added strength.

Fireball tools has some squares, also some good videos www.youtube.com/watch www.youtube.com/watch

For welding Weldingtipsandtricks on youtube and website

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Thank you Glen440. I have watched a lot of videos on youtube and an instructional disc with the Lincoln I bought. I will certainly watch the link you sent and I thank you for it. I know I have so much to learn and a lot of hours to practice. On the bright side, I am anxious and willing to learn. Even if I fail, I tried. It's just that I saw a few sights on the net that sell a cantilever set of arms that look to be about 2 or 2 1/2 feet long for the front end. I'm sure they work fine but it's fun to dream and I like to think that some day I can produce something like the frame on the Tucci model A. It's a few feet longer but still small enough to do bench top. It sure looks nice.

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COBBLE HILL, BC

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There are welders and there are weldors.


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GRIMSBY, ONT

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what model lincoln is it



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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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IMG_6502.JPGIt is the Mig Pak 140 that CTC puts on sale for about $500 that comes with lots of extras like gloves and extra wire and stuff.



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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Oh and I watched the video. Those Fireball squares look great. Thank you for that. I'm checking their other videos too.

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GRIMSBY, ONT

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not sure is that a 220 volt welder



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AJAX, ONT

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That welder is a 120 volt 140 amp, what does it say it can weld inside the door? I would guess 1/8 inch for gas welding.

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GRIMSBY, ONT

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i have a 175 hd  220 v great welder  but i was pushing it to weld my frame  i used 3 /16 wall tubing on the frame



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AJAX, ONT

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Its roughly 1 amp per thousands until around 1/4 inch for gas mig. Its nice to have a machine that is not maxed at the thickness welded. That 140 could do 3/16 in flux core.
Should be able to do a frame in 1/8 with 2x4 box. My car trailer was 1/8 2x5.



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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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I guess my welder will be good mostly for learning with. But it's a start.

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WATFORD, ONT

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There is nothing wrong with your welder, but it does have it's limits. We have the same unit at work, and I have put a lot of hours on it in the last three years. I prefer it over the big welder we have by far for body panels, 18 gauge and the like. I have used it for 1/8 th material when it was used on a smaller quick job with excellent results. Never used flux core with it, always gas. The biggest thing is, it has to have a dedicated 20 amp input. I tried it with a regular 15 amp receptacle when we first got it, and it was nothing but trouble. Crappy welds, irregular arc, tripping the breaker after 3-4 min of spotting a panel. A short 1 inch bead on 1/8th material would trip a breaker. Finally, I convinced the boss to upgrade to a dedicated line and 20 amp receptacle. Ta-da...you would think we had a new welder. Actually we did, but now it acted like a new welder. Arc doesn't wander, nice smooth weld, far less splatter, just better all around. All these problems were from lack of power. (Don't use an extension cord, it gives the same results.) Haven't tripped a breaker since. Also haven't used the big welder in two years, the small Lincoln does it all now. So if your welder is just plugged into a regular 15 amp outlet, consider upgrading to a 20 amp, it will really wake it up. You can still plug into the 20 amp with any regular 15 amp item, it's still 115 volt. You don't lose anything, you just gain an extra plug.

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Thank you Sniper. Yes, one of the first things I learned was to never use an extension cord. Kind of a drag to drag my welding table closer to an outlet whenever I weld. It is big and heavy but I do it. I listen to what I'm told and sometimes I even remember what I'm told. Wuga keeps telling me to upgrade my electric (and insulate my garage). I guess a dedicated 20 amp means 220 instead of 110 ? It sounds like that's what you're telling me. I have a friend who is an electrician so I guess I could have him do it and he would charge me less. I just hate to ask friends for favours like that. People ask him all the time. I guess sooner or later I'll have to join that group. Thank you Sniper.

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WATFORD, ONT

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That welder should have what appears to be a regular 115 volt plug, but it needs 20 amp to run properly. Most 115 volt receptacles are 15 amp, and that is what is acceptable by code for most applications. But, every now and then, something comes along that requires a bit more power such as the welder your using. A 115 volt, 15 amp receptacle looks just like a 115 volt, 20 amp receptacle, but the 20 amp one has a lot heavier internal contacts to carry the additional load. It would also be fed by a heavier wire from the panel. If I remember correctly, the 15 amp would be fed with a 14/2 wire. Where a 20 amp is 12/2, which is a heavier wire. The heavier wire and heavier receptacle will supply enough addition power to run your welder properly. It's still 115 volt, so any 115 volt item you have can still use the new upgraded plug if needed.

Think of your electrical system as a small car with a small motor. All it has ever called for is a small gas line (14/2 wire) and 1/4 inch gas filter (15 amp receptacle) to run it. But now we put in a larger engine (welder) and that small gas line (14/2 wire) and 1/4 inch gas filter (15 amp receptacle) can't suppy enough gas (electrical power) to run it. Replace the gas line with a 3/8 line (12/2 wire) and filter with a 3/8 filter (20 amp receptacle) and now you have enough power to run wide open and not starve it for gas (amperage power).

You mentioned you have an electrician friend, just ask him about it and see what he has to say. He likely can explain it better than I can and may even have the items on hand to show you the subtle differences in wire size and receptacles. Also take a look at your manual, it will tell you for certain what power requirements are needed. Take care.

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PRINCE EDWARD COUNTY, ONT

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Cuddle's problem is that he only ran a 14/2 wire to his garage which means 15 Amp max. If he ran that wire in a conduit, maybe he can use the 14/2 as a fish line to bring in 12/3 and then he will have all the options including heat.

Warren

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WATFORD, ONT

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wuga wrote:

Cuddle's problem is that he only ran a 14/2 wire to his garage which means 15 Amp max. If he ran that wire in a conduit, maybe he can use the 14/2 as a fish line to bring in 12/3 and then he will have all the options including heat.

Warren


 Ok, I see. That does put a new twist on it.



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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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I can see I will have to ask my friend to come and run a bigger wire from the house to the garage. Your discussion just reminded me that when I first started using my welder (back when it was warm enough in the garage) I tried cranking it up after a few low power welds and I tripped the breaker in the garage so I can't even run this welder full out. I guess I'll have to ask my friend to come. I just hate to ask because I know it is like when you own a pick-up truck and suddenly you have a million friends asking to borrow it. But I guess I have no choice. I really want to learn to weld. And those Fireball squares look great ! I researched the Tucci rod some more and learned a bit more about how they made the 2 x 4 frame. Maybe someday I can do stuff like that. Something to work toward I guess. Thank you both. I'll get there eventually thanks to you. And my friend Cam is working like crazy on his 46 Chev pickup. He joined the other site but he'll join here soon I'm sure. He is learning to build too.

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COBBLE HILL, BC

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Running the heavier wire is not a problem.
Figure out how many feet you need. Disconnect the old wire off at the breaker box.
Splice the new wire on. Disconnect the old wire in the shop.
Have someone pull the old wire while you feed the new.
When the new wire reaches the receptacle in the shop, stop.
Remove the old wire.
Call your friend to do the connections.
You may need a larger receptacle in the shop.

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Excellent ! I can do that ! Less work to have to ask him to do. I hate to impose when everyone asks him to do electrical work. Thank you Jarvis1 ! I copied your instructions and I'll give it a try.

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PETERBOROUGH, ONT

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Once it warms up, I'll run the cable from the house to the garage. Until then, I thought I'd make up some squares like Glen440 showed me. It will give me some welding practice & if they turn out they should be handy. I just finished the templates.



-- Edited by Cuddles on Sunday 7th of February 2021 11:01:22 AM



-- Edited by Cuddles on Sunday 7th of February 2021 11:03:14 AM



-- Edited by Cuddles on Sunday 7th of February 2021 12:45:31 PM

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