Ontario yellow safety sticker laws

69SS454 · MILTON, ONT

RE: Ontario yellow safety sticker laws

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

69SS454 wrote:
What is the likely fine for first offense if you get caught towing a 24' enclosed trailer, car on board with a 1/2 ton p/u?

it depends on how much of an a hole the officer/mto wants to be that day. when i got pinched in my tow truck the dink bragged to me he could have nailed me with over 2000 dollars in fines but he only gave me one for unsafe load. in my experience they go easy on you for first offences. like i say though it depends on the mood of the dude and weather the quota for that day has been met

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Thanks Candy Man for clarifying some issues;
I am unclear about one thing you mentioned !! You are correct that the vehicle portion of my truck's ownership states 3000KG, even though the Manufacturer's sticker on my door puts my truck at around 3500kg.
If what you're saying is true, then ANY vehicle towing ANY trailer needs to be yellow stickered (unless it's an RV)!! Something doesn't sound right with that statement. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just saying it doesn't sound right and I will look into it.

It's pretty sad when we can't just go to the MTO website and get this information given to us in layman's terms. It seems any laws written are done in such a way to leave huge gray areas for us to fall in , Just like the emission BS !!!

will · WALKERTON, ONT

Hemi
Did I do the math right - that I am 1675 KG over?
John

I just rechecked the door jam sticker GVWR - 6250 / 2834 KG

I am so glad you did this post. My understanding of this yellow sticker was the actual weight of the rig. Last summer I got it weighed on the local CO-OP scales - truck with me in the cab, the trailer with my hot rod inside. Total weight = 4790 KG. My thinking was that for the first offence and being just 200 plus over the linit, they would let me go with a warning. Maybe?

The price we have to pay for doing what we want to do.

-- Edited by will on Monday 4th of February 2013 07:36:24 PM

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Thanks Seeker;
I just got off the phone with the MTO trying to get clarification on this, and they basically said the same thing.
here it is in a nutshell;

-Truck RGVW + trailer RGVW if greater than 4500kg you need yellow sticker (note: RGVW is not actual weight, but registered weight)

-The 3000kg limit on most pickups (located on the ownership) is what the maximum weight of the truck can be. You are still allowed to tow a trailer, as long as the total weight of the truck including tongue weight does not go over 3000KG. If you need to have the 3000KG increased, then you need to pay more for your truck's sticker. This can be increased no higher than the GVWR from your vehicles manufacturer. (located on driver's door )

-Private individuals (even with yellow stickers ) DO NOT need a CVOR

I hope this clarifies a few things.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

will wrote:
Hemi
Did I do the math right - that I am 1675 KG over?
John

I just rechecked the door jam sticker GVWR - 6250 / 2834 KG
I am so glad you did this post. My understanding of this yellow sticker was the actual weight of the rig. Last summer I got it weighed on the local CO-OP scales - truck with me in the cab, the trailer with my hot rod inside. Total weight = 4790 KG. My thinking was that for the first offence and being just 200 plus over the linit, they would let me go with a warning. Maybe?
The price we have to pay for doing what we want to do.

-- Edited by will on Monday 4th of February 2013 07:36:24 PM

Yes, you did the math right , but you should have used the GVWR of the truck (2834 KG) and not the rating on your ownership (3000KG)!!Either way, you're over !! cry

I'm going to throw a loop into it now !! biggrin

If that enclosed trailer is homebuilt, it will not have a GVWR rating. If this is the case, then the MTO uses the actual weight of truck, trailer and load. Therefore you would not need yellow stickers, but the MTO could send you to one of their scales if they pull you over.

Again, this is only for homebuilts !!

-- Edited by hemi43 on Monday 4th of February 2013 08:18:02 PM

shag766 · FOXBORO, ONT

fatstax wrote:
boats and campers are exempt as you stated earlier, there is some limits on weight but your not going to tow an oceanliner with a ford ranger.

the weight limit is determined by the manufacturer per your vechicle specs. gvrw on your door sticker is the max weight you can haul total. if you are towing personal use no matter what toy with a 1/2 ton and not over the manufacturer gvrw weight, drive on. cvor come into play on commercial trucks. the more weight you haul the more the cost of the lience but you cannot go over the gvrw sticker weight set by the manufacturer.

my escalade has cvor due to it is in company name. dosen't need yellow sticker. my 1 ton dually in company name needs yellow sticker due to its gvrw is over a weight in the 25000-26000lb range. i pay extra for my plates due to the incresed weight hauled, which i do. if i didn't haul trailers and just used for viecle for personal trans my lience price would be set by the gvw on the sticker. once you go over the weight treshold of the 25-26000lb limits you need the saftey sticker, private or commercial.

once truck is stickered, for safety, you also have to be pulling any trailer from 12ft boat trailer up to 2-3 car trailer has to be stickered. any trailer that truck pulls has to be stickered.

i have been doing this for 25-26 yrs now with 8 trucks of various sizes and just went through an mto audit with no issues. these photos show the hi end of start to the trailers i haul. no problems

-- Edited by shag766 on Monday 4th of February 2013 09:56:46 PM

Pint and a Pound · AJAX, ONT

Wonder what the rules are if you a flat towing with a towbar. There is basically zero tongue weight with a towbar and the towed car is not licenced as a trailer so .... ?

Seeker1056 · DOURO, ONT

I think you will find that tow bars are illegal now - thats why you see tow dollies behind RVs now instead of tow bars

hemi43 · ONTARIO

Seeker1056 wrote:
I think you will find that tow bars are illegal now - thats why you see tow dollies behind RVs now instead of tow bars

Interesting point !! I have never heard that flat towing is illegal but I may be wrong. I think the reason people use dollies is to prevent wear on the front end of the vehicle being towed. If flat towing is infact legal I have no idea how the MTO would view that !! Would you need yellow stickers on both vehicles ?? Who knows !! Something else I thought of, is what would the RGVW be of a car dollies since it doesn't carry the full weight of the vehicle. I'm not going to try and find answers to that because it doesn't affect me. biggrin biggrin biggrin

Pint and a Pound · AJAX, ONT

Everything below was just copied/pasted from the MTO website regarding the yellow stickers ... on a separate note, I can't find anything that states a towbar is illegal.

Annual Safety Inspections (yellow stickers)
An annual safety inspection is required:
- on a truck, which does not tow a trailer if:
- the truck's actual weight, registered gross weight or gross vehicle weight rating exceeds 4,500 kgs (9,920 lbs).
- on a truck, which tows a house trailer only:
- if the truck's RGW exceeds 4,500 kgs.
- if the truck's gross vehicle weight rating exceeds 4,500 kgs, or
- if the truck's actual weight (without the house trailer attached), exceeds 4,500 kgs.
Notes:
- house trailer weight is not used when determining a truck's actual weight.
- house trailer weight is used to determine a truck's RGW.
- a house trailer does not require an annual safety inspection.
on both the truck and towed trailer (other than a house trailer) if:
- the truck's actual weight, registered gross weight or gross vehicle weight rating exceeds 4,500 kgs, or
- the actual weight of the truck, when added to the actual weight of the towed trailer or trailers exceeds 4,500 kgs, or
- the gross vehicle weight rating of the truck, when added to the gross vehicle weight rating of the towed trailer or trailers exceeds 4,500 kgs.
This MTO website provides complete details on annual safety inspections:
http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/trucks/regulations/annual.htm

Pint and a Pound · AJAX, ONT

"towed vehicle" means
- any type of trailer, including a house trailer, and
- a tow-along motor vehicle such as car, truck, van, sports utility vehicle (SUV), etc. that is being towed on a dolly or with a tow bar.
- "towed vehicles" means a combination of towed trailers or a combination of towed trailer and towed motor vehicle.
- "vehicle weight" means the actual weight of a vehicle whether loaded or empty.
- "trailer weight" means the weight transmitted to the road by the trailer's axle(s) and is determined with the trailer attached to the towing vehicle.

The above (copied from the MTO site) makes it look like towbars are still legal.

Pint and a Pound · AJAX, ONT

Here we go .... (again from the MTO site) ...

Brakes are not required on towed motor vehicles, whether towed with a tow bar or on a dolly. Tow dollies do not require brakes whether or not the dolly is carrying a motor vehicle.

Pint and a Pound · AJAX, ONT

The below (taken from MTO site) is kinda interesting ...

Towing More Than One Vehicle
Cars, passenger vans and SUVs are not permitted to tow more than one trailer or one vehicle. Motor homes, trucks, pickup trucks and truck campers are legally permitted to tow two trailers or a trailer and a motor vehicle behind a trailer. However, a three vehicle combination that is swaying excessively, is unstable or has reduced handling capabilities is subject to action by the police as an unsafe combination of vehicles under the Highway Traffic Act.
The maximum length of any combination of vehicles is 23 m (75' 6").

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

Picture 177.jpg Picture 178.jpg That 'bit" about House trailers being exempt gets me!!! You could have a house trailer that weighs "WAY" more than a car trailer, or any other ones they say you need sticker for,but you can go down the road with a 1/2 ton & "huge " house trailer, way overloaded but your OK!!! Thought I posted this shot from last spring taking this to scrap dealer. Think I was "OVER"???

will · WALKERTON, ONT

hemi43 wrote:
Thanks Seeker;
I just got off the phone with the MTO trying to get clarification on this, and they basically said the same thing.
here it is in a nutshell;

-Truck RGVW + trailer RGVW if greater than 4500kg you need yellow sticker (note: RGVW is not actual weight, but registered weight)

-The 3000kg limit on most pickups (located on the ownership) is what the maximum weight of the truck can be. You are still allowed to tow a trailer, as long as the total weight of the truck including tongue weight does not go over 3000KG. If you need to have the 3000KG increased, then you need to pay more for your truck's sticker. This can be increased no higher than the GVWR from your vehicles manufacturer. (located on driver's door )

-Private individuals (even with yellow stickers ) DO NOT need a CVOR

I hope this clarifies a few things.

Well Hemi, since I started this whole trailer thing, and we have many different opinions here is what I actually have. I would like to use this as an actual example.

Hopefully this would qualify as what Seeker discribed as a good looking rig that the MTO would not bother. (?)

My truck is a 2001 F150 4 X 4. The gross weight on the Plate portion of the ownership reads 03000.

The info on the door jam reads GVWR 6250 lbs / 2834 KG.

The above info is on my 7 X 16 trailer. Am I reading this right that the RGVW is 3000 + 3175 = 6175 - 4500 = 1675 over. Yellow sticker time for sure?

I have been travelling to Car Shows all over Ontario for the past two summers with no problem.

Please guys, let me know if I am doing this right and if not, what am I doing wrong.

Thanks

John

Pint and a Pound · AJAX, ONT

ANNUAL SAFETY INSPECTION (PMCVI)

These are the yellow stickers that should be affixed to BOTH your truck and traile and have to be renewed every year. The stickers are required on vehicles that have a manufacturers rating, a RGW, the actual weight of the vehicle, or the combination of both vehicles if hauling a trailer, of over 4500 kg.
Example: If your truck has a RGW of 3000 kg, and the weight of the trailer is 1501 kgs, (regardless if empty or loaded) a yellow sticker is required on both vehicles.

http://66.49.173.199/Drive%20Ontario/Truck%20and%20Trailer%20Regulations.pdf

fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

here s a straight answer, last thing im posting.

Who is required to obtain a CVOR?

If you operate the following motor vehicles:

Trucks that have a gross weight or registered gross weight over 4,500 kg (9,920 lb) and
Buses that have a seating capacity of ten or more passengers.
Commercial vehicles plated in either the United States or Mexico

Exemptions

Carriers that operate certain types of vehicles do not need a CVOR certificate. These vehicles include:

A truck or bus that is plated in another Canadian jurisdiction
A truck with a registered gross weight (RGW) and a gross weight of 4,500 kg or less, whether towing a trailer or not
A truck or bus leased by an individual for 30 days or less to move their personal goods, or to carry passengers at no fare
An ambulance, fire apparatus, hearse, casket wagon, mobile crane or tow truck
A truck or bus operating under the authority of a dealer plate or an in-transit permit
A bus used for personal purposes without compensation
A motor home used for personal purposes
A pickup truck used for personal purposes

How to apply for a Ontario CVOR

Operators are required to fill out an application and submit a fee of $250.00 to the Ontario Ministry of Transportation. It take about 10 business days for the MTO to complete the application and issue a CVOR number.

CVOR’s are renewed annually by submitting updated information and a fee of $50.00.

Unsafe operators beware

Operators will have to provide driver’s license numbers, jurisdiction of driver’s license and address of all owners/officers of the company during the application process. Ontario uses this information to cross reference data they have compiled. The purpose of this is to prevent unsafe operators from opening up new companies and obtaining a different CVOR number. It is difficult if not impossible to obtain a new CVOR if your former company was put out of service by the MTO or had a terrible safety rating.

PSTC for all your operating authority needs

For more information or help in applying for a CVOR or any other operating authority call us today at 1-877-796-7016.

Operating Authorities

More information on Ontario CVOR

Ministry of Transportation website

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fatstax · COBOURG, ONT

shag766 wrote:
fatstax wrote:
boats and campers are exempt as you stated earlier, there is some limits on weight but your not going to tow an oceanliner with a ford ranger.
the weight limit is determined by the manufacturer per your vechicle specs. gvrw on your door sticker is the max weight you can haul total. if you are towing personal use no matter what toy with a 1/2 ton and not over the manufacturer gvrw weight, drive on. cvor come into play on commercial trucks. the more weight you haul the more the cost of the lience but you cannot go over the gvrw sticker weight set by the manufacturer.
my escalade has cvor due to it is in company name. dosen't need yellow sticker. my 1 ton dually in company name needs yellow sticker due to its gvrw is over a weight in the 25000-26000lb range. i pay extra for my plates due to the incresed weight hauled, which i do. if i didn't haul trailers and just used for viecle for personal trans my lience price would be set by the gvw on the sticker. once you go over the weight treshold of the 25-26000lb limits you need the saftey sticker, private or commercial.
once truck is stickered, for safety, you also have to be pulling any trailer from 12ft boat trailer up to 2-3 car trailer has to be stickered. any trailer that truck pulls has to be stickered.
i have been doing this for 25-26 yrs now with 8 trucks of various sizes and just went through an mto audit with no issues. these photos show the hi end of start to the trailers i haul. no problems

-- Edited by shag766 on Monday 4th of February 2013 09:56:46 PM

22000 is the limit for a g license,not 25000 to 26000 range. i just posted the mtos rules and you are contradicting them. this is the problem here, nobody seems to know what they are talking about, im done, you people can beleive whatever you like.

hemi43 · ONTARIO

All the information I posted was confirmed by an MTO enforcement officer at the weigh scale. You can lead a horse to water, but.........

Pint and a Pound · AJAX, ONT

fatstax wrote:
you people can beleive whatever you like.

Excellent, I believe I will have another beer biggrin

(just don't tell the wife ... seems "we're" on a health kick ... you know, exercising, counting calories etc ... kinda means a "pint and a pound" won't be on my menu for a while )

hemi43 · ONTARIO

IR Mechanik wrote:
hate to stir the pot more but there is one more thing to consider.
A vehicle over 4500 Kg (licensed or actual) requires a daily inspection. If you travel over 250 km you require a log book. That's 250km from point of origin, as many km as you want just not exceeding at 250 km radius. The daily vehicle inspection book is the one thing the mto always asks for.

I think seeker has it right, if your vehicle is clean and well maintained and you're following the rules to the best of your knowledge the MTO officers are generally good people. If you do absolutely nothing, play stupid or argumentative they will crucify you. I've had a few minor infractions over the years but most times the officers are glad to give advice. Especially with TDG (transportation of dangerous goods) but we best leave that one alone

I banged my head so hard on the table, it's bleeding !! disbelief

Are you from Cobourg too?? LOL Damn nuclear waste !! smile smile smile (that was a joke BTW)

What you are talking about IR, is called a CVOR and it's been posted on this thread quite a few times when it is required. Personal vehicles are exempt. If what you say is correct, then everyone that owns a Dually pick-up needs one because they are all rated above 4500 KG. We all know that is not the case.

edit;

Last post on this because those that don't get it, never will.

Here is a list copied directly from MTO which states which vehicles don't need a log book (CVOR) I highlighed the last one so there's no mistaking.

Exemptions

Carriers that operate certain types of vehicles do not need a CVOR certificate. These vehicles include:

A truck or bus that is plated in another Canadian jurisdiction
A truck with a registered gross weight (RGW) and a gross weight of 4,500 kg or less, whether towing a trailer or not - see Determining RGW
A truck or bus leased by an individual for 30 days or less to move their personal goods, or to carry passengers at no fare
An ambulance, fire apparatus, hearse, casket wagon, mobile crane or tow truck
A truck or bus operating under the authority of a dealer plate or an in-transit permit
A bus used for personal purposes without compensation
A motor home used for personal purposes
A pickup truck used for personal purposes

-- Edited by hemi43 on Tuesday 5th of February 2013 05:12:02 PM

IR Mechanik · INGERSOLL, ONT

hate to stir the pot more but there is one more thing to consider.
A vehicle over 4500 Kg (licensed or actual) requires a daily inspection. If you travel over 250 km you require a log book. That's 250km from point of origin, as many km as you want just not exceeding at 250 km radius. The daily vehicle inspection book is the one thing the mto always asks for.

I think seeker has it right, if your vehicle is clean and well maintained and you're following the rules to the best of your knowledge the MTO officers are generally good people. If you do absolutely nothing, play stupid or argumentative they will crucify you. I've had a few minor infractions over the years but most times the officers are glad to give advice. Especially with TDG (transportation of dangerous goods) but we best leave that one alone

Grabrr · LONDON, ONT

I looked at the ministry website, to get a CVOR, you just have to fill out a form, and pay $250? Since I own my own business, and sometimes I haul rooftop air conditioners on my open car trailer..I better cover my ass?

John, I can tell you from experience, it doesn't matter how good you look, the cops will still pull you over. I was in a new "lettered" van, with a brand new single axle 12ft enclosed trailer (matching colours) and I still got pulled over by some punk kid cop...

-- Edited by Grabrr on Tuesday 5th of February 2013 10:40:54 PM

IR Mechanik · INGERSOLL, ONT

I apologize, you are absolutely correct Hemi43. My post was poorly worded. If your commercial vehicle is over 4500 kg, requires an annual inspection sticker then it also requires a daily trip inspection.
I just wanted to point out if you're going down the road of getting a cvor and annual inspection there are a few more hoops to jump through.
The CVOR is renewed yearly ($50) and they want to know the annual mileage. Any infractions incurred (accidents, safety violations and road infractions) count against the cvor (regardless of operator)
Too many infractions and the MTO will audit you, come to your house and take away your birthday.

will · WALKERTON, ONT

Grabrr wrote:

John, I can tell you from experience, it doesn't matter how good you look, the cops will still pull you over. I was in a new "lettered" van, with a brand new single axle 12ft enclosed trailer (matching colours) and I still got pulled over by some punk kid cop...

-- Edited by Grabrr on Tuesday 5th of February 2013 10:40:54 PM

Dave, I knew personally I would not qualify as for good looks, BUT was hoping my truck and trailer might.

Just amazing how interesting this thread has become. Two pages. Hope everybody learned from or at least got what they were looking for from it. Shows just how confusing some issues really are.

Let's get back to hot rods.

OldGuy 71Acadian · ONTARIO

IR Mechanik wrote:
I apologize, you are absolutely correct Hemi43. My post was poorly worded. If your commercial vehicle is over 4500 kg, requires an annual inspection sticker then it also requires a daily trip inspection.
I just wanted to point out if you're going down the road of getting a cvor and annual inspection there are a few more hoops to jump through.
The CVOR is renewed yearly ($50) and they want to know the annual mileage. Any infractions incurred (accidents, safety violations and road infractions) count against the cvor (regardless of operator)
Too many infractions and the MTO will audit you, come to your house and take away your birthday.

Daily Inspection not required within a 100km radius.

Basically the 4500kg combined weight should be heeded. This number use to be 11,000kg, but has steadily dropped over the years, to the now current 4500kg threshold. As mentioned in previous posts, there are some allowable rules depending on combinations pulled. Some cases allow the actual weight of the tow vehicle plus tongue weight of the towed vehicle as the determining factor. confuse

As you have read here, going to the MTO website will spin your head and fry your brains with gobs of info for "what if" combinations. Ask two different MTO Officers and you'll get two different answers. ashamed

Iwannagofast · ONTARIO

Didn't we have a site Member who is an MTO officer? Perhaps he/she could weigh in.

oldkoot · BROCKVILLE, ONT

Now I'll really cloud this whole issue by asking" are you required to pull into the weigh scales" on places like the 401?