Hello all. I've been a quiet member for about a year. My son and I restored a 69 Impala Sport Coupe and finally got it on the road last August. I'll post some pics soon. This car is MORE or less his. I have just this past winter started a project for myself. '47 Plymouth Special Deluxe. This car, however, I want to do most of the work, from frame to body and engine myself. I have stripped the car down to the frame. I plan on doing a bit of a custom rebuild. Plan to leave off the front fenders to expose the engine. The original engine, flathead 6 purrs like a kitten. The problem though, when I leave the fenders off, obviously the engine is exposed. Flathead 6 has intake and exhaust on one side and electrics on the other. Not too appealing. I have decided to replace the engine with a 318. Having read some articles, I understand I can get a few more HP out of this engine. Don't plan anything crazy. Would appreciate any advice on this rebuild. The engine is in the garage on a stand and well on the way to being broken down. This engine only has around 165,000kms. on it. Never been touched. I'm getting it ready to send out to be boiled and checked out. I live in the Midland area. Does anyone know of a place close by to have the engine block,heads crank etc. checked to see if I have a good engine to start with. This is my first crack at rebuilding an engine, could really use some advice. Thanks
What year engine is it? '88 came with roller cams, '92 Magnum, FI, (not throttle injection).
Like Hemi said, you might get better heads, like 360's, but...if you already have 202 heads on the 318, or factory roller cam set up. Depending on year...
360 heads, mild cam, four barrel intake and carb. That's all you'll need to liven up that 318.
yeah but no
360 heads result in even more loss of compression ratio if just bolted on
a pre 72 (71 & earlier) 318 was good for 250 hp
a 72 was rated for around 145 -50 BUT got the good electronic ignition
find a 70 318 for the heads or the 360 heads and buy pistons for the 70 - now you have compression that will let you make some power
I was a dodge dart duster fan in the way back - I would not bother to buy anything newer than a 71 motor - or at least I'd build it like it was a 71
I did the 360 head swap on a 73 318 - turned a good peppie motor into a slug - then someone explained I'd droped the compression ratio just by bolting on the heads
Hi, Done a lot of Mopar builds. including 318s. I am assuming you have an LA engine or late model post 1968 engine. (Not an early Poly 318 or 313) It is highly unlikely your engine will be cracked unless it was froze and froze hard. Mopar block are quite high strength. However any machine shop will check that as a matter of course after cleaning. The best heads are from a 86 fifth avenue engine or any 318 in that era. They have a chamber more like the old 273 HP heads. Arruzza Engine got 55 more hp with them then the 360 heads on a back to back dyno test. I use them as well. Very well suited to the nice well mannered but powerful street motor. A windage tray from a 340 is worth a few hp and it is the kind of HP that doesn't wear out. A performer intake works wonderful wit a 600 Eddy carb. Basic cam choice is a stock 68 340 cam however comp cams Extreme energy serious offer some real power bonuses without giving the engine bad manners. I have used a lot of them in SB mopars since they were first developed. If you want I will give you a specific build. Part numbers and all. More then 1 HP per cube is easily done without making the engine rough. That said Why not a 360? Best bang for the $ in a small block mopar. You can almost get them for the taking away. They have an ideal bore stroke ratio. Also ideal rod length ratio and are a very well designed engine. Helped a friend do one a couple of years ago for his wife's 70 Dart. It idles at 550 in drive and is deceptively good running but turned 12.97 on its first attempt at Shannonville. He was absolutely shocked. Figured maybe low 14s. No funny parts either. When building engines that go and don't break the bank the trick is to make sure every part is happy with its neighbour. All the right parts are always faster and more reliable then expensive high dollar exotic poop. When the whole choir is singing the same note it is a lot nicer and louder them when everyone is doing their own thing. Engines are the same.
Either engine though should be easy to do and not expensive if you pay attention and don't get swept away by the herd. don
-- Edited by Don on Sunday 25th of May 2014 07:08:12 AM
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360 heads, mild cam, four barrel intake and carb. That's all you'll need to liven up that 318.
yeah but no
360 heads result in even more loss of compression ratio if just bolted on
a pre 72 (71 & earlier) 318 was good for 250 hp
a 72 was rated for around 145 -50 BUT got the good electronic ignition
find a 70 318 for the heads or the 360 heads and buy pistons for the 70 - now you have compression that will let you make some power
I was a dodge dart duster fan in the way back - I would not bother to buy anything newer than a 71 motor - or at least I'd build it like it was a 71
I did the 360 head swap on a 73 318 - turned a good peppie motor into a slug - then someone explained I'd droped the compression ratio just by bolting on the heads
to bad me so sad lol
I've built 2 older 318's over the years and put 78' 360 heads on them. Machined .060 off of the surface and did mild port work. Ended up around 9:1 CR. Used Comp Cam 268H with an Edelbrock dual plane and Holley 4150 600cfm. Perfect street engine for an A-body IMO.
You can't just grab a set of heads, bolt them on and hope for the best. You obviously didn't CC the heads or you would have found out that your compression would have been too low.
Everyone and I mean EVERYONE is building cars using "different" engines these days ....... early hemi's, nail heads, early this that and everything else so they can "be different". Why follow the crowd? I say do something that NO ONE ELSE is doing right now ...... that's right, go ahead and install a small block Chevy
Everyone and I mean EVERYONE is building cars using "different" engines these days ....... early hemi's, nail heads, early this that and everything else so they can "be different". Why follow the crowd? I say do something that NO ONE ELSE is doing right now ...... that's right, go ahead and install a small block Chevy
What????
works for me.......i don't think my 50 coupe would be terribly competitive with a studebaker engine.
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don't walk in like you own the place..........walk in like you hold the mortgage.
I would like to say welcome to the silly house ..Sounds like a couple neat projects..Lotta good knowledgeable fabricators and engine drive train wizards on here..I learn everyday from somebody..
So welcome and have fun ..don't take what anybody says too serious and just let the rough ones roll off it's like a 24 hr news cycle, things come and go and change daily..It all in good fun
welcome from the belleville area.
for a first thread you are going to hit a home run OR help the rangers win with a couple of the replies.
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this will end up in off topic---"I say do something that NO ONE ELSE is doing right now ...... that's right, go ahead and install a small block Chevy" balls-y shaker, balls-y, lol-lmao
check with ponch to see if this is the first intro that went off topic
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again welcome aboard and yes there are some smarts on here, good luck with the project
Hi Don. Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. I'm up to my eyeballs in alligators at work. I now have the engine completely broken down and ready to send out. I'd like to get 220-230HP if I can. Any help on specs would be greatly appreciated. I've heard NAPA is pretty good with machining, especially the group in Listowel.
This engine came out of a 85-86 Diplomat. From the numbers on the heads I understand they are known as "FAST BURN" heads ??
Hi Don. Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. I'm up to my eyeballs in alligators at work. I now have the engine completely broken down and ready to send out. I'd like to get 220-230HP if I can. Any help on specs would be greatly appreciated. I've heard NAPA is pretty good with machining, especially the group in Listowel.
This engine came out of a 85-86 Diplomat. From the numbers on the heads I understand they are known as "FAST BURN" heads ??
Mark
If you are talking about Ideal Supply NAPA in Midland, I believe all major machining is done in Listowel. Thats what we do here at the Hanover shop anyways. Our guy here does head work and some assembly of engines when he has time. Crank and block machining gets done in Listowel.
Hi Don. Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. I'm up to my eyeballs in alligators at work. I now have the engine completely broken down and ready to send out. I'd like to get 220-230HP if I can. Any help on specs would be greatly appreciated. I've heard NAPA is pretty good with machining, especially the group in Listowel.
This engine came out of a 85-86 Diplomat. From the numbers on the heads I understand they are known as "FAST BURN" heads ??
Mark
aren't fast burn heads small block chev ? maybe you're thinking of chrysler's lean burn engines ?
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don't walk in like you own the place..........walk in like you hold the mortgage.
Hi Don. Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. I'm up to my eyeballs in alligators at work. I now have the engine completely broken down and ready to send out. I'd like to get 220-230HP if I can. Any help on specs would be greatly appreciated. I've heard NAPA is pretty good with machining, especially the group in Listowel.
This engine came out of a 85-86 Diplomat. From the numbers on the heads I understand they are known as "FAST BURN" heads ??
Mark
aren't fast burn heads small block chev ? maybe you're thinking of chrysler's lean burn engines ?
85-86 engine would in fact run the "Lean Burn" system. It doesn't affect the combustion chamber design, or the runners. The good part is, you won't need hardened valve seats, if you use those heads.
But if you want to hit 220 hp, they won't lend themselves to it, without a lot of work.
Since you have it apart, I'd go with '88-'92 engine configuration, they have a roller cam set up (roller lifters), frees up a few ponies.
If you go with '92 or newer LA Magnum 302 heads, the intake has a different bolt pattern and so do the valve covers and the oiling through pushrod etc.
I'd for sure up the compression ratio, if you are doing a full rebuild.
If you use stock 360ci heads, throw in 1 extra point of compression ie: 9.5 to 1 > 10.5 to one. The combustion chamber is much larger on a 360ci head and you will loose approx 1.2 points of compression.
Or like Hemi mentioned, you could shave the 360 head .060" to regain that compression point, but you lose some volume. You would also have to machine the heads on the intake side, a good engine machine shop will have a chart for the ratio, I believe it's .0012" for each .001" taken off the cylinder side.
I prefer the "915" heads, those are the casting they used for T/A's, they flow great.
I'd prefer staying with higher flow, as opposed to higher compression. The flow increase, will increase your dynamic compression (filling the cylinder more).
1 point of compression will not gain you that much HP,
The 268H cam, suggested early is a nice street grind. I run a 284 Cam Dynamics in a 340. I wouldn't over kill it with too much duration or lift, for the lift I'd go somewhere in the neighborhood of 430" at valve (zero lash). Maybe a MP#P4452759.
The 340 and 318 engines, run the same cranks, same journal dia.'s, main and journal and same stroke. (lighter then 360 reciprocating mass.)
So basically, all top end work.
And off course headers, what goes in must come out.
Air Gap intake #7576 works really good also on the intake side, topped with a 650cfm.
It all depends on your budget, but that should get you well in there.
..Sounds like a couple neat projects..Lotta good knowledgeable fabricators and engine drive train wizards on here..I learn everyday from somebody..