need some help with emissions on my 85 pontiac trans am

toomuchjunk · S/W ONTARIO

RE: need some help with emissions on my 85 pontiac trans am

Petebil · ONTARIO

Very interesting !!
I too just called Rick Lalonde and had a great conversation with him.
Here's what I got from him;
If your vehicle falls into the "hot-rod" category, and your engine was installed after Jan 1st 1999, then you must have all emission equipment that came with the engine. This includes cats, evap etc... Here's the big one----> If your replacement engine is either OBD1 or OBD2, the engine must also have the original computer because it is part of the emission equipment.

The info Ben posted is correct. If your replacement engine was available for your model car ( i.e. displacement and type) you will not be viewed as a "hot-rod", and then you can legally use that engine regardless of how new it is as long as the original emission controls of the car are retained.

-- Edited by Petebil on Thursday 15th of October 2015 01:36:02 PM

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

I'm confused, this is contrary to all the rules that were stated before & what is listed on MOE site!!!

Petebil · ONTARIO

Looks like you may have to give Rick a call too.

studeshaker · BUCKHORN, ONT

dualquadpete wrote:
I'm confused, this is contrary to all the rules that were stated before & what is listed on MOE site!!!

i agree pete, it doesn't seem to reflect what is actually happening on the street in our area.

dualquadpete · BLACKSTOCK, ONT

studeshaker wrote:
dualquadpete wrote:
I'm confused, this is contrary to all the rules that were stated before & what is listed on MOE site!!!
i agree pete, it doesn't seem to reflect what is actually happening on the street in our area.

Your right Doug, my friend in Port Perry had the MOE come to his house & go over his vehicles, the 28 model A mother's Pizza Rod with vette drive line had to have all the emm. crap from Vette , they looked at his 87 Suburban & found a few things not right + his Indy pace truck & he has fixed all the issues. SO that said, the 1928 is a 'true " hot rod" but still has to have the canister, Cats, Egr etc. & that came right from 2 of the road Inspectors He's been pulled over twice, once in "burb" & once in pace truck & no problems as they didn't even get started when they recognized him "He's Good' So where did this HOT ROD ruling come from??? for a 85 trans am, if a 1928 with vette engine, rear end etc. has to have all the $hit on it!!!! MOE has been present in Durham Region this season & in the PORT PERRY especially [ they seem to like it here] I think it would be good for the MOE to come to some local shows & cruise's & set up an "INFO" booth or table & explain in " black & white" & language we can understand what's required, no ticket books allowed, & just inform us what we need [other than cancelling the whole program]

chips · Veteran Member

dualquadpete wrote:

Your right Doug, my friend in Port Perry had the MOE come to his house & go over his vehicles, the 28 model A mother's Pizza Rod with vette drive line had to have all the emm. crap from Vette , they looked at his 87 Suburban & found a few things not right + his Indy pace truck & he has fixed all the issues. SO that said, the 1928 is a 'true " hot rod" but still has to have the canister, Cats, Egr etc. & that came right from 2 of the road Inspectors He's been pulled over twice, once in "burb" & once in pace truck & no problems as they didn't even get started when they recognized him "He's Good' So where did this HOT ROD ruling come from??? for a 85 trans am, if a 1928 with vette engine, rear end etc. has to have all the $hit on it!!!! MOE has been present in Durham Region this season & in the PORT PERRY especially [ they seem to like it here] I think it would be good for the MOE to come to some local shows & cruise's & set up an "INFO" booth or table & explain in " black & white" & language we can understand what's required, no ticket books allowed, & just inform us what we need [other than cancelling the whole program]

Here is how I understand things although I must point out, I am NOT the definitive source for correct information though, for that I suggest a person contact the MOE with their specific combination.

If the replacement engine is a different displacement (or make) than what was available in that year of car, the MOE views the car as a Hot Rod. It doesn't matter that a 305 and a 350 are both small block Chevrolet engines (just for example), what matters to the MOE is whether or not the replacement engine (make OR cubic inch) was ever offered in that year of car. Since a 1985 Trans Am was never offered with a 350 cubic inch engine, the MOE now see's it as a Hot Rod.

Being viewed as a Hot Rod by the MOE does NOT mean you don't need any emission controls or that the emission controls needed are (in your friends case) what came on the 1928 Pizza Rod the replacement engine is now in, it means the required emission controls are the ones the engine came with. If your friends 1928 Pizza Wagon has a 1964 Vette engine installed, he needs the emission controls from the 1963 Vette. If the engine came from a 1981 Vette, he needs the emission controls the 1981 Vette had, which would include an EGR, PCV, charcoal can, etc.

As Petebil stated, there are other issues when a person is dealing with OBD stuff. Since in my specific case, my car and the swapped engine were both built before OBD, I was not informed as to those specific rules.

Once again, this is just my very basic understanding of what is required and why, a person really needs to contact the MOE directly for the laws pertaining to their specific swap. I did, I printed it out and I should be good to go. If the laws change, I will have documented proof that I was legal at the time the engine was installed.

51 Styline · NIAGARA FALLS, ONT

I think Pete is right on. The MOE has to get out and explain the program to the Hot Rodders and their own inspectors. The confusing part is everyone has their own interpretation of the act and all these postings don't clear anything up. It seems the Ministry has its idea of the Act and the inspectors have their idea. This is not helping anyone and until its cleared up this thread will just continue to grow and be just as confusing. Its about time the MOE got off their butts and tried to clear things up.

chips · Veteran Member

66-67-88Chevy wrote:
I just contacted the MOE with the number that was posted above and got my answer and email proof to print off and keep in the car. Easy. That number is a direct line. Receptionist put me through immediately. 10 minutes is all it took. Also have an email with proof. I talked to Rick Lalonde.

Found out that I can put in my 74 motor into the ,68 Camaro and run only the 1968 emissions. Like everyone's saying,take 10 minutes, call and get proof.

ENVIRONMENT AND CLIMATE CHANGE
OPERATIONS DIVISION
SECTOR COMPLIANCE BRANCH [Telephone Directory]
416-314-4278 - Branch Assistant
Fax: 416-314-4464
Address:
Suite 1000
305 Milner Ave
Toronto ON M1B3V4

Sorry, just re-posting as I corrected the MOE persons name from Mike to Rick smile

-- Edited by chips on Saturday 17th of October 2015 08:55:08 AM

chips · Veteran Member

51 Styline wrote:
The confusing part is everyone has their own interpretation of the act and all these postings don't clear anything up.

I completely agree with the above statement, which is precisely why people need to contact the MOE directly with the specifics of their swap, print out the answer and keep a copy in their car.

66-67-88Chevy · BRANT COUNTY, ONT

Thanks Chips, I just wasnt thinking straight when I posted the name...