Can anyone please suggest a youtube video that will show me how to properly remove cylinder heads from a 66 289 ? Or even provide step by step instruction without a video ? Thank you. I found two vids but in the first by Thunderhead289, he drops the push rods ( I think they are called ) all over the place when he lifts the head. And the 2nd video by Eric the car guy wasn't all that clear to me.
Don't know of a video, but about the pushrods etc. If you are reusing them, they should go back in the same position that they were. That goes for the rest of the valvetrain too. I used to take them out one by one and label where they came from, which was top/bottom etc. The rocker arms can go in a baggie with each posh rod. The same with lifters if you are going that far, each lifter should go back on the same lobe of the cam.
I'm doing my best to learn (the right way). Baggies and cardboard seem to be the trick. "lobe" ? Hmm ? I only intend to take off the heads so I can take them in to a guy for any repairs necessary. So I only want to dismantle enough to get that far. Push rods have to come out after I remove the rocker arms (I think they are on top holding the push rods in). Once I have the push rods out, I think I can unbolt the heads and lift them off. Lifters and stuff are for the guy at the shop to do I think because that requires special skills (dangerous springs). That's my understanding so far anyways. Surprised that there are so few videos on youtube for this when there are so many videos for everything else. I saw some cars have roller rockers that look to be more efficient. I guess they cost but good things do. I might inquire when I take in the heads (if all goes well). Thank you both. I need that kind of support and info. Confidence isn't one of my strong points.
Drain the rad. Disconnect the battery. Remove the intake, etc. etc Go to your local supplier and see if there is a book on how to. Or order off the interwebs.
lifters can stay in the block .. just NEVER turn the motor upside down or they all fall out.
AND >>IF if you have it on an engine stand MAKE SURE .. you keep the bolt tight or pin in that prevents a drunken idiot buddy from flipping it upside down..
had that happen .. valve covers .. carb .. intake ,,, heads all just placed on the engine for mock up...
lol IF I weren't such a nice guy there might be a big bag of heads out in the shed...by now... (cough)
watching later as he doped his brand new gear drive set up on the floor ...
well some say Karma is a B####, but I've found her to be my very best friend...
-- Edited by DJD on Saturday 20th of March 2021 02:49:43 AM
Thank you Jarvis1 and DJD. I don't know what a gear drive set up is but it sounds like Kharma came back to bite. And I will check the site and the book. Thank you both. I know I need a good book. I don't have any yet.
Hi Jarvis1: The site you list here to check on the HAMB was my post. But it worked out fine. A guy named Demonfox 5.0 came through with a video and all the other assists added to my knowledge or reinforced what I have already learned. You wouldn't be near Keith would you ? I notice you always come through (like so many others) with really solid advice and tips. Thank you all once again.
Be careful of anything an engine rebuilder recommends.
I've had the worst advise from them in the past.
FYI: lifters are UNDER the push rods. You can see the tops of them. They ride on the lobes of the camshaft.
The bottom of the push rod is being "lifted" by them.
The heads have valves, valve springs, retainers and keepers.
Thank you for the images DJD ! Now I know the parts and how they work and any confusion about lifter/tappet is clarified for me. I have a zinc additive in the garage I was told to buy to add every once in a while because it is an older engine. Is that what you mean Jarvis1 ? And how am I to know if Demonfox5.0 is an engine rebuilder ? His instruction for removing heads appears logical and safe. If you meant someone else, I do try my best to find reliable sources (like here). Thank you again everyone ! I'll get through this.
I have a zinc additive in the garage I was told to buy to add every once in a while because it is an older engine.
Zinc additive is for flat tappet cams. I believe that's what you have as you mentioned upgrading to roller looked like a nice thing, or something to that effect.
Roller cams don't need zinc as the roller rolls and doesn't rub on the cam lobe.
My comment about trusting engine rebuilders is mostly about what parts they recommend.
If you were gonna change cams, don't just accept whatever someone recommends. That goes for any parts recommended.
Post here, do research, etc.
One more thing. Since you have the heads off, have you checked how far from the deck they are down?
It's a good idea to record this info for future mods you may want to make.
It will also come into play picking head gaskets as well.
Also, take pics of the tops of your pistons to note any valve reliefs.
My next question is... if an engine has ran for 40 years, and the castings are now oil
soaked, does it still need zinc additive?
If there is machine work being done and all new surfaces, then and maybe the zinc additive
will be needed.
zinc is a lubricant for parts that create extreme presures at the contact points
that pressure is from the resistance the valve springs provide down through the push rod , through the lifter and into the cam lobes as they turn below the lifter
kinda like lead in gas was used to "cushion" the stop of the valves against the valve seats until they started using hardened steel seats
changing from a lifter that slides on the cam to a lifter with a roller that rides on the cam changes the pressure created friction into a rolling friction between the cam / lifter and the pin of the roller lifter's wheel..
however , you have to have a "roller cam" to use a roller lifter
there are two difference that create a roller cam
first the cam lobe profile is changed.. when compared the roller cam will have a rounder tip to it's lobes and will appear "fatter" at the "ramps" where the lifter approaches the lobe tip and travels past the lobe tip..
also , roller cams are harder steel than a slider style cam .. to prevent the rollers from wearing out the lobes
so , if you want to convert to roller lifters you HAVE to use a roller camshaft
(fyi , a gear drive , replaces a timing chain with a set of gears that drive the camshaft instead )
Geez! This is wild. I actually understood this (or most of it). 123pugsy - I don't know what the deck is ? Probably something obvious like the surface of the block ? "how far from the deck". So it looks like I can't consider roller lifters without introducing a new camshaft. OK. Now I know. But they sound like a good thing. And gear drive sounds like it is probably much more efficient so probably expensive. But still a nice idea. And if I understand correctly, I don't need to bother using a zinc additive on a regular basis. Thank you everyone. How do you guys learn and remember all this ?
Forget the roller lifters and rockers unless you are building an all out performance engine. You can't just go plunking pieces here and there without looking and considering the whole package. You started out wanting to fix a bad valve and have moved on to injecting hundreds if not thousands of dollars whilly nilly into the engine. Pull the heads, fix the problem and drive. I would dvise that first you get heat in your garage and then, if it can wait, do the heads next winter. Right now driving season is coming, so get out and drive.
Deck height is the distance from the top of the block down to the flat of the piston when the piston is at top dead center. This generally ranges from .000" to .100". If you are rebuilding an engine, usually .010 is removed to true the block. In my case I removed .080 to get compression.
Note what type of head gasket is used since they can range from steel @ .023 to composite @ .048.
I thought that roller rockers were just an improvement on an old idea to keep parts from wearing out so fast. I didn't know they were for racing. Am I doing more damage to my engine running it on 7 & a half cylinders ? #4 is only pumping about half what it should.
Bill wants me to take my heads to Dean Ireland in Young's Point and said that Dean would also have the gaskets I need. Do you recommend some in particular or should I leave it to Dean ?
Just get out and drive ? OK, twist my arm.
From top of the block to tdc on the piston. Got it. Thank you Warren.
Thank you 123Pugsy. If we can overcome the red zone restrictions, maybe Bill can show me how to determine the proper gasket thickness needed. I doubt I have the proper tools. I would love to get out and drive it as Warren suggests but it doesn't look like there are many destinations to go to yet with the virus still looming so I think I'll have the valve repaired first. I'm not in a rush. Thank you again.
yeah, ..I was only trying to illuminate a few reasons things are different along with the reason for the zinc in oil..
I will add though , IF you have a buddy with some experience , ask him to look at your motor once you have the heads off
consider the mileage on the motor and check the hone and or piston ring ridge at the top of the cylinders..
if excessively worn , repairing heads alone can be a bad idea
used to be, one could refurbish the cylinder heads only to have the lower end start to give up shortly afterwards because of the wear in the piston rings / cylinder walls
worn heads let some pressure escape..
fresh heads do not but if the lower half is worn .. it causes a worn lower half to allow combustion gasses that once might have leaked past the valves to leak past the piston rings
I don't want to cause another reason for alarm , I'm just sayin' have a buddy that knows what he's looking at , see things...first .. before you start spending money
The guys are offering great advice. I see you have a 1966 289 ? Incredibly tough high revving units they are.
I'm just wondering if you have an HO 289 ? They a bit different with heavier rod bolts and such. Do you know where it came from ? I'd guess that a 55 year old engine has some wear.
Certainly after that amount of running time, those cylinders are gonna have ridges, and valve seals are all dried up, with every other seal and gasket. Any Idea the mileage on it ?
I'm know I have new unused rocker arms for a 69 I had. Might only be 8, I don't remember, but you can have them.
Didn't those old engines use 'Umbrella' valve seals guys ?
If it does have high miles, go with a new 'bicycle' timing chain and gears. Gear drive ain't gonna do anything except cost ya money unless you're racing it. same as going roller anything.... Just my opinion, and I'm sure I'm gonna get crapped on as usual.
My first place for research is here and two other forums. Always great advice. When it is safe to do so, I will ask my friend to look at the heads & the motor. I have no idea of the mileage on the motor but he might be able to give me some idea. He, like people here, has a lifetime of experience with motors. I am totally unfamiliar with most of the signs to look for concerning engine wear but that's ok if I am here to learn. And I doubt that my 289 is an HO 289 (if that means high performance of some kind). That is so kind of you to offer the new rocker arms supernash. If my friend tells me I need them, I will let you know. In my research, I learned of roller rockers and a gear drive. I didn't know they were for racing. But now I have a better idea of what they are and why. These forums are so helpful. Thank you everyone.
I guess I could call Bill to go for a cruise to nowhere or meet with Dave from Barrie in Uxbridge (while maintaining 6 feet). I was just hoping for diners to be open but I should be more patient. It will come.
Eat an ice cream while my friend hooks up the 220 - great idea. Extra outlets ? Another great idea I hadn't thought of. That welding table weighs a ton now and it is hard to drag it over to the outlet by the big door. Excellent idea. Thank you both. If Alyce gives me a hard time about the ice cream, I'll tell her Pugsy advised it and put the blame on him. ha ha ha
My friend Gary will come over to do the electrical work after the lock down I guess.
Speaking of Ice Cream, my youngest son is putting the finishing touches on his Ice Cream trailer. He's calling it " Good Manners". It'll be stationed out front of our place - 4022 Victoria ave, Vineland - opening May 24. Lots of parking. If you're out for a cruise in Niagara pop in and introduce yourselves.
